Kriya the misunderstood Yoga

[kriyawit]

Hello everyone I would like to start a thread concerning Kriya and discuss topics related to it and try to unravel some of the mystery concerning what it is and is not.

I would also like to present sources where those interested in technique may receive good instruction based on my actual experience.

This thread will not seek to defame or promote any one lineage or teacher, that is counterproductive and is not permitted on this site. Furthermore this thread shall not seek to state that kriya is either better or lesser than any other practice that is subjective as all spiritual practices are. In other words the eye & experience of the beholder.

So lets get started shall we?

1st a list of sources one may learn the techniques of Kriya from that are good and reliable in my opinion and experience:

In person and getting personally taught as this is the very best way in my opinion:

I am told by a fellow Kriyaban (that is a person who practices Kriya) that Ashok Kumar Singh of California USA  http://www.vedickriyayoga.com who teaches in private has added many riches to her life from what he has taught her and is extremely pleased. I have been told by others that this person teaches the original unmodified version as was taught by Lahiri Mahasaya. Unfortunately I can neither confirm nor deny this as I have not been taught by this person and sadly if I was ever taught by Lahiri Baba in a former life I do not recall so corroboration is impossible.

Kriya Yoga Institute of Florida USA and is a worldwide organization http://www.kriya.org I have been initiated into this lineage and taught by the Swami's as has my Mother whom I brought to this school of Kriya. From the last statement one can tell I highly approve of this source since I brought my own Mother to it. KYI will teach anyone who asks to be taught. The Kriya they teach is unlike other schools or what I have been able to discover in books or anywhere else for that matter. I suspect it is a modified version that was modified by Sri Yukteswar. This version is powerful.

Now for the not in person ways of learning:

Ennio Nimis: I can not say enough good things about my dear friend Ennio. Enno helped me through some really rough patches in my initial sadhana in Kriya. Ennio was the first to truly break the secrecy surrounding Kriya and if anyone is interested you can read his 3 part book which is free to anyone who wishes to download it from his site. http://www.kriyayogainfo.net This book is a story of one mans journey to find the true Kriya and the struggles he endured in his search and is a story everyone who is involved in sadhana ( Spiritual Practice ) no matter what forms it takes should read. The book then goes into how the various techniques of Kriya are performed.

J.C. Stevens Author of Kriya Secrets Revealed: Complete Lessons and Techniques available on Amazon.com . Mr.Stevens who is also a friend of Ennio has taken it upon himself to create a workbook that a completely uninformed person could learn to practice Kriya from, for those who have read Ennio's book you will see Ennio's material in it as well. Ennio And Mr. Stevens are on good terms nothing to be concerned about there.

From these 4 sources that I am very well aware of one may learn Kriya if they wish to there are many others of course but these are the ones I will vouch for.

It is often difficult to describe what a thing is and sometimes better to take the opposite approach and describe what it is not.

Kriya is not a religion.

Kriya is not only for Monastics Celibates or Swamis. One need not become involved in such a way and join an Ashram to learn Kriya or practice it. In fact the founder Lahiri Mahasaya often advised to remain in the householder life raising your family and working to earn a living.

Kriya is not a method that requires a long period of time sitting.

Kriya does not take a long time of practice before the person practices it gets something from it even though expectation is discouraged, which I think is kind of funny because when practiced sincerely by focused attention on the techniques you get the results weather you want them or not just like sawing wood produces saw dust.

Kriya is not the cure all for disease of poor health.

Kriya practice does not require a specific Asana be performed or hand mudra be used but it is not discouraged either.

Kriya does not require full Kechari Mudra but when the energy demands it the tongue will go where it must, this I relate from experience and when it does in this manner and it comes in this way then it makes a big change in sadhana.

For some like myself I achieved stage 3-4 Kechari within a matter of months because the energy within demanded it and evidently unbeknown to me the physiology of this body was either altered first in the prana Kosha or was just a lucky draw of the genetic hat.

Prior to Talavia practice and Kriya Sadhana though I can say my tongue would never enter the places it does now.

I can only relate my experience and say for me cutting was not needed, I can only relate that it happened this way for me, I have no knowledge of how it is for others nor if they get the same thing out of Kechari.

Kriya is not just about individual Chakra Focus although some schools do teach this more heavily than others. More on this: Kriya does use Chakra focus in such a way that one is able to enter into the Sushumna or central channel, until that is accomplished and the true breathless state is had all else is just preparatory to getting one there then that is when the real work begins and it is done in joy and ecstasy.

Kriya does not omit Japa though some schools teach it in later more advanced practices and the japa can become very complicated in some schools.

Kriya is not the property of one group or another or one persons way of teaching it or another.

Well I think that is enough of what Kriya is not, how about some What it is?

Kriya, true Kriya must trace it's lineage back to Lahiri Mahasaya, he was the founder and a householder.

Kriya is specifically for the householders that is the class most people fortunate enough to be employed fall into like myself we work, we pay mortgages, taxes etc... from us all of society is upheld.

We of this position in life have little time for hours long meditation. Those who have the time or are Monks are also allowed to practice Kriya but it really is for the householder and as such it is designed specifically for those with little time to practice.

Kriya is a form of Sadhana ( Spiritual Practice ) that works primarily with the Prana Kosha.

Kriya practice is about releasing and unraveling certain Psychic knots Granthis in the Sushumna so that Kundalini can flow. When Kechari occurs as a result of sadhana practice one of these knots is released and unobstructed flow is experienced. I speak from personal experience here not just theory.

Kriya is often said to be scientific which irks me a bit because it sounds like a sales pitch. Kriya practice does give repeatable results and experiences by doing it.

Kriya gives results swiftly.

Kriya only requires 20 to 30 minutes to practice and is advised to be done twice daily but once or even more is just fine. On this topic long periods of sitting unless guided by your inner knowing are discouraged. A wondering mind is a waste and one would be better off sweeping the floor taking out the trash cleaning the dishes helping your neighbor, cooking dinner, helping the kids with homework than sitting around daydreaming in fantasy land.

When it does happen that you find that an hour or two has passed and you were unaware of times passage and you were in deep sadhana this of coarse is the exception and it was obviously needed. One of my favorite phrases on this site is just that self pacing. What a wonderful correct teaching.

Kriya is intense it is not a lazy or passive technique, Kriya requires sincerity and focus on the practice of the technique and Bhakti developing the ability to Love God and have love for God. God is not a religion no religion owns God rather all religions are Gods property, this is what I believe but belief is not necessary.

Kriya practice enables / causes one to experience bliss and stillness of mind.

Kriya Practice overlaps into your daily life in a good way.

Kriya practice is cumulative in it's effect.

Kriya aids one in becoming more introspective without falsified effort it is a natural by product.

Kriya is a practice whose goal is liberation and the return to our spiritual nature which is always present. So return is not the correct phrase rather the purpose of Kriya Sadhana is to develop out ability to be aware and conscious in ways we currently are not and this leads to liberation.

The easiest way to say this is lets say for example one is overly analytical. Then through the practice of Kriya somehow there consciousness there awareness developed , evolved and they developed this attribute of empathy to a greater degree than they were previously capable of experiencing would this not be an improvement to the character we are speaking of?

I think the answer is yes. You see even though this person was not a horrific monster who hurt animals or anything like that this person was what one would call thick skinned calloused in many ways by life and not as loving as they should be. Then through the practice of Kriya this person of Analytical mind started to develop a heart and many other more positive attributes would this not be a spiritual evolution and advancement in awareness and conscious capability?

I think the answer is yes because I am describing myself.

Kriya is a powerful practice that can cause emotional instability at first until one develops the ability to work within the framework of being more empathically sensitive.

Kriya can cause changes in ones personality which is to be expected as one evolves this does not mean one becomes a different person, rather one becomes more of what they all ready are.

Hey this is getting too serious and it reminds me of a joke by Bill Cosby, the one where he asks someone why they take Cocaine the person replies because it makes my personality more intense.

Bill Cosby replies yeah but what if you are an A$$hole? I love that line

Honestly though it is not like that. Just like all sadhana practices Kriya brings out the best of what you already are.

Questions, Comments?

[parvati9]

Thank you Kriyawit for this opportunity.  While having several questions regarding Kriya, I've been reluctant to research or investigate into the subject.

My question is concerning sleep apnea.  Generally there are only negative comments about sleep apnea.  But for me there is nothing negative about it.  I don't see it as a problem or like it is wrong.  Unlike most people, I don't mind it when my breath spontaneously and naturally just stops while sleeping, and I certainly don't want to do anything to 'fix the problem'.  (Please don't tell me how serious it is and I must find a way to fix it.)

I would like to know if there is any relationship between sleep apnea, Kriya and kundalini awakening....  And do you think there is a way I could use this naturally occurring breathless state to my advantage?  Or do you also see it only as a 'health problem'?   According to Deepak Chopra sleep apnea is a health problem caused when the pharynx or windpipe collapses during sleep.

[kriyawit]

Sleep apnia is not the same thing as when the breathless state occurs in sadhana. The breathless state occurs when the energy and the bliss are so strong and the mind so silent and the attention of pure awareness so riveted on that which words will fail to describe. Mind is gone in this state only awareness exists.

The body requires nothing at this point so it does not breath, I have had it occur where my heart stops beating as well this has only happened once and the silence and peace is beyond discription.  During this time the spine vibrates from crown to perenium and Golden Whit light is perceived with different eyes as the eyeballs do not see.

When my heart started again it skipped its timing then beat fast then beat normal and slow. This brought me out of the state and the body breathed but just normaly no gasping. I remember thinking body do as you will very peacefully.

When this happens it does so because the practice of sadhana has caused the kundalini to become active and the body is taken care of in an unusual way. That is the best way I can describe it.

Now least someone get the wrong idea that side effects of Kriya Sadhana make a person someone to respect, let me dispel that illusion. If I cut wood and get sawdust do not be impressed. If you cut wood and get sawdust like mine I will not be impressed. It is like this I think.

Your question is certainly valid as the external phenomina appears similar. One more point when breath stops in sadhana the throat remains open it is not like swimming holding the breath on either the inhalation or the exhalation.

Please see a Doctor for treatment it is just not the same.

[Holy]

Hi parvati9,

stoppage of the breath while sleeping does happen here too. It surely has something to do with the spiritual practice. If it happens here, the body seems to need to sleep longer, if astral happenings still continue. If the whole body-mind gets still, then the body needs less sleep if this happens. It does not happen often, but sometimes it happens.

[Holy]

Hi kriyawit,

ok now we are getting really into it Thanks again for your sharing, as in general kriya yogic practice results on the net are rarer than rare. In this regard AYP is pretty unique, as the whole topic from practice to results are shared openly. Shure, there are some experiences that cannot be shared by words, or you may say most, but there are other observable points which are a very helpful and inspirational hint for those having started to practice or for those who are more advanced, but still at the beginning

The experience of kechari mudra was very similiar here to your experience. After lots of kriya breaths the tounge just goes up and at some point enters the pharynx. Here it was perceived as a mixture of pranic force and grace =P But the whole process took some 2-3 years and the tounge stayed in kechari level 1 (AYP chart) for many months before that day of first entry.

Regarding to the amounts and timing of kriya practice, Gurunath's kriya is pretty scalable. You can sit for 30-45 minutes per day and have results, you can sit for 2-3 hours and have accordingly results, you can also sit for 8-10 hours and have results. It depends on your bhakti and lifestyle.

Householder kriya yogis under Gurunath practice about 36-288 kriya breaths and the relating number of maha mudra per day. Some of them after 6+ years just need 1 SBP to wake up kundalini and enter into samadhi at the crown easily without side effects. This translates to about 0,5 to 6 hours per day. More than 2 x 1,5 hours per day is not practical for most householders, but some of Gurunath's students have practiced at least temporarily the full amount also as adviced by Lahiri Mahasaya, which is 600 kriya breaths and 50 maha mudras. Afterwards some of them were adviced by Gurunath to take it more easy and to peace down

Most probably it is this what kriya yogis refer to as scientific. You can count how many kriya breaths will produce which result. According to Lahiri:

12 perfect kriya breaths result in pratyahara
12 x 3 = 36 result in the cleansing of the nadis (for this reason numbers of 36 are adviced by some kriya masters like Gurunath)
12 x 12 = 144 result in dharana
12x12 x 12 = 1728 result in dhyana
12x12x12 x 12 = 20736 result in samadhi

20-30k hours of kriya breath (split into days, months and years)according to Hans result in nirvikalpa samadhi.

quote:Kriya Yoga Institute of Florida USA and is a worldwide organization http://www.kriya.org I have been initiated into this lineage [..] This version is powerful.

quote:Kriya only requires 20 to 30 minutes to practice and is advised to be done twice daily but once or even more is just fine.

As it seems the kriya you describe has changed dramatically. From your description it seems to be more effective (like AYP) and for that reason is adviced to be practiced in little amounts only. The variant of Lahiri and Gurunath is not that effective, but can be practiced in greater amounts if one wishes. Would you like to report from your practice routine/amount and how the results evolved over the years?

The other question would be, is the kriya yoga of Hariharananda/Prajnananda still scalable, means does it remain stable in greater amounts per day or does it get problematic if one practices more than e.g. your mentioned 30 minutes (like in AYP)?

quote:The body requires nothing at this point so it does not breath, I have had it occur where my heart stops beating as well [..] During this time the spine vibrates from crown to perenium [..]

First, much thanks for this openness! This is rarer than rare The suspension of breath is pretty natural after good amounts of kriya breath, the suspension of breath + the heart is already highly advanced and experience reports to that you can count with one hand =P Besides the classic masters Lahiri, Yukteswar and Co, Yogananda has some detailed reports, Hans also speaks from his experience and there you are nearly at the end when it comes to reading about this. Seeing in person or talking/hearing is different, more advanced practitioners will speak about it.

This body-mind here is not yet capable of that level of silence, yet every year its capacity rises.

A question to that: obviously the kriya you practice works pretty nice. Can you talk about the smoothness/difficulties of diving into stillness from your daily practice and the smoothness/difficulties within daily live happenings inbetween sessions?

It would be pretty interesting to hear from a practie routine that is efficient and smooth in daily life. The more efficient the techniques, the more self-pacing seems to become a topic. Your experiences would be welcome to hear

Thank you very much for this open contribution,

happy practicing and lovely results to all

[parvati9]

Hi Holy

Thank you for commenting.  It doesn't happen often with me either but when it does, it's just fine.    It only started after my kundalini activated.  As I don't recall breathing ever stopping before that, I think there is probably a correlation.   When it awakens me, I am able to enjoy a lovely blissful moment before breathing starts again.  In my case it's very comforting, not something to fear at all.

[kriyawit]

Thanks again for your sharing, as in general kriya yogic practice results on the net are rarer than rare.
 
@ HOLY

I am glad you brought up this point, I have noticed it as well and in communication with other Kriya practitioners have surmised the following:

The first thing to understand is I do not consider experiences personal. I consider Kriya Sadhana experiences to be universal to all who will practice the techniques.

When I saw wood it is not personal to me I smell the wood, it is not personal to me that the wood gets on my clothing and my hands, it is not personal that the sawdust makes me sneeze, and it is reasonable that one should discuss the byproducts of sawing wood so others interested in sawing wood will understand what will happen and plan accordingly. Sawing wood in the living room is generally not well accepted by the wife.

Kriya as you may be aware is a fragmented mess. In my experiences Kriya is taught by many different sources in many different ways most resemble one another with the exception of what KYI Teaches it is very different.

Every source without exception claims only they teach the real Kriya wether they come right out and say it or cleverly beat around the bush and allude to the superiority of their method there is no escaping this common theme.

But the way KYI teaches is very similar to others in the following regards.

Sharing Kriya Technique is forbidden one is instructed to send interested parties to KYI for training. I actually agree with this as the training they provide is very thorough and in depth. It takes 2 whole days.

Talking to others about Kriya experiences is discouraged because others will think you are crazy, yes they actually said that and you know they are correct about that as well.

While what I report is factual and truthful including the stopping of the heart, who could believe such things without having them happen to themselves? Should I not be dead instead of typing this? Logically there is only one conclusion this person typing is a liar.

I would also like to submit that of the many that become initiated for many reasons I would not be surprised to discover hardly any practice once let alone twice daily. For me this is easy because there is a draw to do so without that it would be like forcing myself to go to the gym and workout. So I think people either have the draw to do this or they do not.

Everyone is different for me energy manipulation was something I was born doing and was astounded to discover others had no idea what I was talking about. So I think that not everybody gets the experiences all at once and there is no way to force it. It is like playing music it just comes to you, fortunately one does not have to be a musician born to arrive at this. Kriya practice brings this when then time is right. I believe this because my own inborn ability has grown so much in such a short time by practicing this sadhana.

Here are some more points:

Subjective Ignorance: Kriya is a very powerful psycho emotional technique, the practitioner is both the scientist and the subject and unless one has the ability to be very, very objective and detached from ones own subjective experience they are going to be lost to some extent in ignorance until they do develop this faculty which fortunately does come from the practice of Kriya.

Mis-training: Those whom are taught Kriya are largely mis-trained by others whom are also mis-trained but this is not on purpose. People also fail to learn correctly due to being too subjective and not analyzing deeply enough what they are being told and innumerable preconceived ideas. Kriyabans are told not to attach to experiences. This is a very serious mistake on the part of the teacher to tell someone this and not thoroughly understand it oneself or fail to communicate this concept correctly.

Suzuki the famous ZEN teacher always instructed people that if you label something as bad or don't do this or that then it creates problems in the mind. For example smoking is bad or thinking don't smoke. for a smoker trying to quite this causes a reinforced attachment to the idea of smoking and all kinds of emotional reinforcement. Instead Suzuki simply said ''Not to do''  so it is better to think smoking is not to do. This is simple and to the point and creates no problems. Not doing, is doing something. We are always doing something even if it is not doing, this is the human way, there is no other way for us and saying don't do something and following through with it are impossible because it suggests an unreality that is impossible to achieve.

So the boogyman of attaching to experiences if forbidden this in turn causes a guilty attachment to the one who is doing the experiencing by correctly practicing the technique they were taught and also creates fear in the person and disappointment because they are experiencing bliss and they like it. It is like telling a little boy not to look at the pretty naked woman that just lost her top on the screen and cover your eyes.

You know the little boy is going to peek.

See a vicious circle.

I say it is no different than sawing wood, I get sawdust, if I do not see sawdust then perhaps I had better check to see if the wood is getting cut. Perhaps I have the saw upside down? One should keep their own way seeking mind / beginners mind this I learned from Suzuki as well. Unfortunately it also happens that people turn over there own sawdust making to others when they see no sawdust of there own. This is not to do. Keep sawing, keep moving the arm with the sharp points touching the wood.

Kriya is not about making sawdust however this is true. One has to allow the experiences to occur neither attempting to exaggerate them or ignore them, one has to become the witness while being as one with the experiences and at peace with the process and if it is enjoyable then enjoy it fully and it will exhaust itself to be reborn ever new then a whole new vista is discovered that goes beyond language. This I submit is the correct approach.

Kriya is a process that is performed experienced and then goes beyond both. The after effects of Kriya continue on with a certain momentum like rolling a ball even after the time of sitting is done and it is the invisible changes that are the point of sitting in the first place and performing this technique. When one becomes objective enough these changes are seen, until then it is leading up to the time when one will and more.

Overtime one will get a different mind, the mind will grow up, the mind will mature, the mind will be silent and little by little living through direct awareness becomes the normal mode of living and mind is seen but during this evolution one will fall back into mind living many, many, times only to re-emrge above it. This is what I know so far.

So why does this person Kriyawit write and ignore convention? I do so because it helps me better understand what I have come to know and communicating with others helps this process as others respond.

There is also an inner pressure to do so I do not fully comprehend but it has nothing to do with a crusade or a mission. I had many questions at one time and still do the practice of Kriya sadhana is giving me the answers and I am sharing the answers I get and the sawdust so others can have something to find when they are looking for truth of actual experience rather than a sales pitch.

I am certain that Ennio feels the same but with him it takes the form of teaching Kriya technique with me it takes the form of sharing what Kriya technique causes to happen as I discover them.

On the topic of Kechari it seems Kechari happens when the time is right and to the degree it is correct for the one practicing sadhana to experience. For me it occurred swiftly and deep all at once. I think it can for others also because it did so in my experience but understand that this is just one way it happens for various reasons.

On the topic of KYI Kriya being very advanced that is a hard one to say yes this is true it is so superior so advanced etc.. Because this is subjective and it really only matters to the one practicing anyway. So to this I say go and get the training and judge for oneself that is what I did and can report it is powerful and it is good. I can also report that I had very rapid changes take place and they were not all pleasant nor easy to deal with and the organization was not very helpful. Even he who initiated me was very slow to respond to e-mail and when he did I was given politicly couched answers that were only serving to protect an organization from potential lawsuit. In person however the communications are more helpful and the people are very nice and kind.

I can also report that the first Kriya they teach of 8 total techniques has proven to be enough for my Mother who has tried to move on to doing the second Kriya technique which is actually the first but is not comfortable with it and has chosen to remain with the first technique and this is not even the powerful Kriya Pranayama. So you see ones mileage will very, I dive deeply into each technique whereas Mother can only take the first technique. My Mother is in her late 60's and as such life has taught her self pacing.

On the topic of self pacing it is an absolute must do. When I feel tired or rough it can be from one of two things either an excess of energy brought on by Kriya Practice which can make a persons body feel tired but in fact the cure is to do some physical work and this is proven out by the fact that once I start working I can't stop it is like a wellspring of energy was present and not using it was making me tired. Using it instead constructively makes me feel rejuvenated.

The other thing that happens is that the body is adapting to the changes Kriya brings to the nervous system and needs rest when this happens I can lay down and fall into a sleep that is not sleep and witness every breath involuntarily entering and feeding some thing I can not identify but the feeling is refreshing beyond description. Were I to guess I would say this is the pranic body feeding.

Even though I practice daily I do enforce one or two days off when it feels correct to do so but this is done on purpose not by laziness.

On the topic of scalability you certainly can do more as per your capacity to do so the individual must discover what that is for themselves. I have tested this and it can cause unpleasant side effects. 1 KYI Kriya Pranayama Round can easily take more than 5 minutes.

This is a very energetic practice and as such creates very strong effects with very little repetition.

1 or 2 rounds is more than enough on average to create complete sense withdraw and lead to what they call the paravashta state. I have done as many as 12 which took me 1.5 hours and the momentum created was with me for many days and required of me not to practice Kriya in order to recover it was very hard on my bodies nervous system to adapt to and assimilate and caused unwanted phenomena to include drastically increased emotional empathy and exaggerated response to stimulus. Because of this I say more is not better until it is ones time to do more so Self pacing is very, very necessary.

On the topic of smoothness and diving deeply the entire procedure takes 20 to 30 minutes from 1st method to last. Diving deeply is no different than strapping on diving gear putting weights on your belt and getting in the water. You just slip into the depths.

The Kriya techniques are designed to do just that swiftly take one to the depths by doing each technique in the proper way in the exact sequence which creates a synergistic effect.

Trying to do Kriya Pranayama proper without the techniques that proceed it drastically reduces it' effect.

So it is scientific in that by practicing technique 1 through 8 each time the same things are experienced the only variable is the degree to which one will apply themselves to correctly performing the techniques and how much one can be the witness and how much one can love GOD. The last ingredient is very important it is the hardest for some to grasp and has absolutely nothing to do with religion.

To develop love for God and the capacity for bearing it one needs only think of something or someone they love or remember an event that brought love into your heart to the point where you were so overjoyed you felt the need to cry because the strength of love was too strong to suppress. Remember with feeling and when you feel this know that the outward form was just the outward manifestation of God and dive deep into the core of the feeling and there at that moment you have it, you have God, truly God is the nearest of the near and the dearest of the dear and if you will but try this you will understand everything.

[Holy]

Hi kriyawit,

thanks for the detailed answer. The flavor of that technique has come out of your description pretty clearly.

The observation to love and god here is, that the practice itself leads automatically to it. After the main techniques are done, in paravastha immersion in peace, love, bliss happens and afterwards all shines through more and more and throughout the day aswell.

And yes, the experience here is too, that the whole sequence of techniques results in the most balanced full spectrum effect.

[kriyawit]

@ Holy

I am pleased to have been able to write clearly enough to be understood thank you for drawing this out of me by asking. You understand everything so nicely and reply 100 percent correctly as well with allot less words.

The only thing I need to clarify is the bliss and everything else happens while practicing the techniques from the very start as one goes from technique to technique the induction of bliss grows ever greater.

[apatride]

A few months after I discovered AYP, I've been initiated to Kriya Yoga (Swami Shankarananda Giri lineage) back in June 2011.

The whole meditation routine took me 40 to 80 minutes depending the time spent on each step. Soon I experienced strong pressure in my forehead, maybe I should have self-paced at that time but I was ignorant of such a concept and not driven to do it by the master who initiated me.

I stopped practice because I was experiencing very unpleasant pressures in my head, and a lot of mood swings (irritablity, anger and so on). After 1 year of Kriya practices, I stopped it all.

After 4 months without practicing, and pressures remaining, I came back to AYP in hope of smoothing it. After 3 months of daily AYP deep meditation practice, the pressure is a bit more manageable but still very unpleasant at times.

Physical exercises and social interactions help me not being too focused on those pressures. It's like meditation is driving me to learn something, the hard way.

Maybe you could have something to say about it, given your Kriya experience? Shall such pressures pass eventually?

Thank you for sharing all of this, by the way

[kriyawit]

I may be able to help I will contact you in private.

quote:Originally posted by apatride

A few months after I discovered AYP, I've been initiated to Kriya Yoga (Swami Shankarananda Giri lineage) back in June 2011.

The whole meditation routine took me 40 to 80 minutes depending the time spent on each step. Soon I experienced strong pressure in my forehead, maybe I should have self-paced at that time but I was ignorant of such a concept and not driven to do it by the master who initiated me.

I stopped practice because I was experiencing very unpleasant pressures in my head, and a lot of mood swings (irritablity, anger and so on). After 1 year of Kriya practices, I stopped it all.

After 4 months without practicing, and pressures remaining, I came back to AYP in hope of smoothing it. After 3 months of daily AYP deep meditation practice, the pressure is a bit more manageable but still very unpleasant at times.

Physical exercises and social interactions help me not being too focused on those pressures. It's like meditation is driving me to learn something, the hard way.

Maybe you could have something to say about it, given your Kriya experience? Shall such pressures pass eventually?

Thank you for sharing all of this, by the way

[Christi]

quote:Originally posted by apatride

A few months after I discovered AYP, I've been initiated to Kriya Yoga (Swami Shankarananda Giri lineage) back in June 2011.

The whole meditation routine took me 40 to 80 minutes depending the time spent on each step. Soon I experienced strong pressure in my forehead, maybe I should have self-paced at that time but I was ignorant of such a concept and not driven to do it by the master who initiated me.

I stopped practice because I was experiencing very unpleasant pressures in my head, and a lot of mood swings (irritablity, anger and so on). After 1 year of Kriya practices, I stopped it all.

After 4 months without practicing, and pressures remaining, I came back to AYP in hope of smoothing it. After 3 months of daily AYP deep meditation practice, the pressure is a bit more manageable but still very unpleasant at times.

Physical exercises and social interactions help me not being too focused on those pressures. It's like meditation is driving me to learn something, the hard way.

Maybe you could have something to say about it, given your Kriya experience? Shall such pressures pass eventually?

Thank you for sharing all of this, by the way

Hi Apatride,

Make sure you are doing enough grounding practices. Long walks in nature are the most beneficial. Strong pressure in the head and mood swings are both classic symptoms of over-purification happening in the body. Other grounding practices include digging in the garden, sweeping out the yard and so on.

Other things that you may find helpful are to drink plenty of water and get at least 10 mins rest after practice. If that does not help to reduce the pressure then cut back on your spiritual practices, reducing the time spent in Deep Meditation, or even switching to breathing meditation if necessary. If all else fails, then take a few days off, or even a few weeks off if you need to. It is more important to stabilize the energy in the body and bring it down to a manageable level than it is to continue spiritual practices.

Some people like to continuously push the envelope in terms of purification as it makes them feel like things are happening, but in my experience it is not a faster journey, just a more uncomfortable one.

Check out this lesson on kundalini symptoms and remedies:

http://www.aypsite.com/plus/69.html

And this lesson on suggestions for over-sensitive meditators:

http://www.aypsite.com/plus/367.html

All the best

Christi

[kriyawit]

Christie makes a very good point here there is no need to be uncomfortable and pushing the envelope really is not needed once you find out what too much is. I found it useful to find out what too much is and in that way learned what it felt like when it was happening to better avoid doing too much.

The other end of the spectrum is doing too little so it is a balancing act and one has to learn how to feel this out.

The way I do this is by feeling and listening to the inner self when it feels right to do more Kriya Pranayama's I do but only 1 or 2 cycles more. Then after practice I pay close attention to the feedback and determine where I am.

For example just this morning I practiced two additional Cycles because it felt needed but I can tell that two additional was one too many so I will return to my former count and wait until it feels correct to try again but only add one additional count and review the feedback.

Speaking for myself I do not find it useful to change my practice from Kriya to another form of sadhana.

( I must admit I have considered AYP but over the last few days this has gone from my consideration Yogani truly has a very good system developed here )

 I have found it useful to practice different Kriya methods that are often of a different lineage than the one I was initiated into or even allow the inner self to guide the pranayama and have learned new Kriya like Pranayama techniques this way. But these new things revealed have been like using a special tool at the right time and have never replaced the correct torque wrench of Kriya I was taught for long, they are more like using the correct tuning fork to tune a musical instrument back into a correct energetic harmony.

I do not find it useful to just stop for long periods of time. 1 day or two at the most.

It has also been my experience that there is no stopping once I started. From personal experience the best thing one can do is once they find themselves firmly committed to the path of Kriya Yoga and it takes over on it's own and sadhana is / has become directed by inner need just get out of your own way and adhere to a schedule.

As a householder I have a very busy schedule and work full time. This does not permit me the freedom of just fitting practice into my day so I discovered the only way to be sure is to practice right out of bed by waking up earlier in the morning the rest of the day can then do as it will. Since this is the only time I have control over once the day gets started it has become my habit. This habit has led to me waking before the alarm and even if I feel like laying there I start hearing the sound of the Nadis and the desire for Kriya is experienced the body starts feeling waves of bliss flowing and that is all it takes. Out of bed and onto the cushion it is time.

 I tried the not practicing approach in the past especially right after Kechari first occurred because the side effects were so strong. From this I learned that not practicing Sadhana is not always the cure in fact it may be the worst thing on can do and lead to even more energy build up and problems.

Exercise and long walks did not work either I had to work it out in Kriya sadhana.

Long walks were out of the question as well because I kept exiting the body via the Sahasrara and the body would literally fall if I were not careful.  I attempted this going on a short walk with my wife and the world turned sideways on me and I started falling to the left luckily I was able to pull back into the heart center and anchor myself but this was hard work and walking was not easy to accomplish and carry on a conversation at the same time.

As soon as I got home I struggled through a shower and then sat down on the couch because I felt like I was going to fall and exit. This made things worse I kept attempting to leave via the crown so I was out of options and the only thing left was to sit in Kriya and work this out in Sadhana.

I excused myself and sat in asana the feeling of relief was immense from the moment I assumed Asana and began. The energetic system erupted in bliss and every center was enlivened and vibrating this was so strong it made me somewhat fearful so I prayed.

 I practiced what I was taught with sincerity and attention to the sacredness and I prayed to God and Lahiri Mahasaya not to let me go too far too fast to please prevent to much advancement too swiftly as I can not keep up.

Kechari snapped into place on its own as it always does and the circuit was made completed even though I had attempted to keep it from happening because it was Kechari happening that had caused all of these issues in the first place.

As it turns out this was the only cure to allow the energetic system to take over but to also guide it via technique and harmonize it by loving God and feeling Gods grace, this calms and harmonizes beautiful shakti and the union was made. For those whom have experienced this you are well aware of how the body will react and the classic image of Shiva in Union with Shakti is so correct!!

After this sadhana these extreme side effects that had me in a state of emergency lessened and I still continued Kriya but with Ennios good advice tried a different technique that actually helped balance the energy system further this involved paying attention to the energy flows within the context of Kriya Pranayama but altering the method as the energy dictated rather than conforming the energy in a magnetic envelope and forcing it to perform in a certain way. From this I learned a new technique that came to me in the coarse of paying attention and listening to what the energy wanted.

A common mistake that is made is that people who experience this energy do not take into account that it is intelligent and knows where it needs to go.

A real problem with organizations and traveling gurus is that there communications infrastructure is absolutely terrible and no where is this more evident I am sorry to say than in Kriya circles, which is shocking given how easy it is to receive and respond to e-mail.

Something everyone needs to understand about Kriya is this it is a system that works with energy and when you get in a difficult place with this energy you need to work it out in sadhana and become the witness and work with the energy, it can and will teach you, but not if you are too controlling and treat it like a raw dumb force akin to electricity even though it shares outward phenomenal characteristics.

Love of and the capacity for loving God is soooooo Important and words just make a person sound like a religious fanatic or a Bhakti trip out of control but the truth of the matter is love of God is so much more than emotions thoughts and words can ever really make understood and it is a special grace that when brought into ones life and ones Sadhana will take over and make things right. Let go and Let God what a pithy saying... it however does not make it any less true.

[Christi]

Hi Kriyawit,

Thanks a lot for sharing your experiences with kriya and welcome to the forums.

There are special cases of energetic overload, as you have observed, where even taking time out of practices and using grounding methods such as walking does not seem to help. One of these special cases is where the crown chakra (sahasrar) has been prematurely activated to a large degree. Your description of falling over whilst walking because of the opening at the crown is one which I would call a premature activation.

Can I ask what route you use for your kriya practice- in other words what are the two end points you are using?

It is true that kundalini is an intelligent force and knows where to go, but in my experience she does not always know how fast to go. So do be careful as she could run away with you if you give her too much liberty. Hence the need to pace practices carefully.

Also do you practice meditation as well as your kriya practice? I know that some schools of yoga brand themselves as "kriya yoga" schools but actually teach a lot more than just kriya practice.  

You might find these lessons helpful on the premature awakening of the sahasrar chakra and the risks involved:


 The drama of a premature crown opening


 Inner energy collisions and strong emotions

Energetic overload certainly can be handled through practices in subtle ways but it is a difficult art as I am sure you have found. In AYP kriya practice is sometimes advised as a method for dealing with energy imbalances as it can help to balance out the energy between the pelvis and the head. It can also help remove obstructions that may be causing difficulties. But it is only used lightly as a remedial technique. The danger of using spiritual practices as a method of dealing with energetic overload is that it can simply compound the issue if the issue was caused by excessive spiritual practices in the first place. Sometimes there can be a delayed reaction in these cases of days, weeks or even months, where initial experiences of relief can backfire on us later on. So tread carefully if you are taking that approach.



Christi

[kriyawit]

Hi Christie and thank you very much for the welcome, everyone has been so nice here.

Without going into too much detail as it has already been alluded too here the Form of Kriya KYI teaches is not like the classic Muladhara to Ajna taught by the other schools I am aware of, The Kriya of KYI is indeed Crown centric there is not 1 specific endpoint more than this I can not share.

Speaking only for myself I never had any issues with this practice until Kechari happened. This practice did however cause Kechari to develop at a very swift pace as the energy flows demanded the connection be made.

I know for many that Kechari does not create such an impact but my experience was that of night and day.

I believe that what was happening was a rewiring or remapping of the subtle system and it would seem there were alterations in the physical as well besides the obvious ability to move the soft pallet foreword and insert the tongue into the nasal Pharynx. I never had this motor control until Kechari promoted via sadhana occurred.

At any rate this was causing the crown to be too powerfully Magnetic if you will and when it connected with Muladhara the result was something akin to a Mahasamadhi event. Till this day I am certain had I remained passive and not pulled back this message would not be getting typed. I am certain this must be how great Yogis go into Mahasamadhi and exit the body.

The only difference is they are in control I was only in control of preventing it, and it was hard work.

Part of what I had to do was not practice Kechari but I admit I failed at this miserably even from the start. Yes I could force the tongue to stay down but that was just it I was forcing it to to stay when it wanted to go.

By not practicing Kechari the energy flows were not as well connected but this just heated up my nervous system so I invariably allowed Kechari to occur but I shunted the attention from the crown to Ajna instead.

The difficult part was learning which is done by feeling

What I discovered mostly is that this energetic system we are requires learning we have to learn about it by working with it

The way it is taught by KYI is there are the techniques themselves which do bring one to the point of what they call  Paravashta and once this state is reached one stops all Pranayama and simply experiences this state which is often called the after effect of Kriya or after-poise

At this point I have experienced being devoid of all senses and the very thought of reconnecting to them is alien un unthinkable unfortunately this very thought can cause just that.

So when in this state I just become the witness to the deepest extent possible and observe. While here many things can be observed at first to include the results of ones practice the feeling and movement of energy ecstasies.

It often comes to me to pay attention to the breath and the energies which are mostly magnetic like and ecstatic to indulge in in nature flowing from the centers up into the head via the tongue in Kechari. Where the tongues tasting side touches the Sphenoid Sinuous structure and up above into the soft areas rather than reaching forward to the ledge on top of the center of the nasal Pharanyx. When this is going on the tongue is not a tongue anymore It is more like a conduit of life force and is so much more important than a organ to taste food with. I literally feel waves of life force moving in the tongue around it and on the surface of it as well as out otf the tip and depending on where it contacts the inner-structures of the skull there is a different result.

When pointing fore-ward touching the nasal septum along the center line energy will conduct back into the lower centers from the higher. This can be aided by moving the tongue from right toe left to center and focusing on the desired center and the energy can be felt going into it.

While pointing forward and ecstatic conductivity demands the tongue go foreword and up to the top of the Nasal septum and rests on the ledge with the underside of the tip and even a little hgher yet where  softer material is encontered this will cause the eyes to rivet on the root of the nose between the eyes magnetically and without effort and energy is conducted into ajna.

Allowing the tongue to lay against he sphenoid sinus structure and up above it into the soft area and one will feel the energy flow into Sahasrara and experience the ecstasies & most profound of all states heretofore known to me.

Then all concern of the lower centers ceases to be of any interest it is not that they are bad or lower or unfavorable it is just that there specific harmonic frequency of energy is un interesting compared to the chakras in the head and the beautiful intoxicating harmonies they resonate at they are so alluring as to make all else inconsequential. It is when dwelling here that the most sublime ecstasies are known and in merging being with this seductive beautiful harmony there is no effort needed at some point just like falling asleep at night one goes else where and is not aware it has happened until they return just like waking in the morning the only difference is you are aware of returning to ecstasy you were just in but for whatever length of time you were not there either and that is when it becomes understood that as unbelievable as it seems there is yet a place higher that one is not consciously aware of being until the lower state of ecstasy is descended back into. At this point the ecstatic state that lead you elsewhere is recognized as being rough and crude compared to where you just where, even though on the ascending phase it seemed so sublime and refined compared to prior to sitting practicing Kriya the everyday world awareness is even more crude yet but one carries more and more of the other with them everytime one returns so this makes it livable to be in a body of meat and bone..

I surmise that this is what all of the practices reach towards and the goal is none other than being able to interact and be consciously aware and inhabit these rarified dimensions of awareness and being and the practices develop the entity that we truly are so we are aware it is remarkable because we already have all of this about us already and we just can not operate thusly while inhabiting flesh.

So to theorize and go out on a limb I would have to say learning to live in a different kind of body which is needed to live in a different kind of world than earth based existence. For example it is impossible to take this meat and bone body and use it in an energetic realm. Bare in mind this is all guess work concerning what higher states of consciousness are because when reached I can not bring anything back to talk about I just know I was there by the fact that I ceased to be anywhere but did not cease to exist and only know of the coming and going by the return to bliss which was a higher vibratory state than before practicing Kriya but is recognized as lower than the indescribable place I just descended from.

This is where I realize breathing was not going on and 1 time realized the heart was not beating.

It appears one has to reach a very high state of energy and bliss and ecstasy to go to this whatever it is and in doing so the after effects are greatly curbed as I guess the extra-dimensional nature of these travels bleeds off the excess energy somehow as one is shunted to a higher state and like attracts like and stays there?

I am sorry and deeply apologize for not being able to make this more clear but there are things words can not describe and I feel like a 1 legged man dancing around in a circle at this point.

I am pretty sure this encompasses the definition of Meditation as I have read it it certainly goes past Dharna and dhyana

Definition:
In Dhyana, the meditator is not conscious of the act of meditation (i.e. is not aware that s/he is meditating) but is only aware that s/he exists (consciousness of being), and aware of the object of meditation. Dhyana is distinct from Dharana in that the meditator becomes one with the object of meditation.

As one may imagine this can also make the flesh body tired at times. I fully believe the energetic body adapts first then the flesh body plays catch up.

KYI does not teach what I have just shared what they teach is that when the paravashta state is reached no one can tell you how to do it or not do it this you must discover on your own. I share this bit of info because this is not something they can teach so it is Oath free as far as I am concerned.

Christie you are so correct it is a delicate art but it is also ecstatic and beautiful. The term overload however is not quite correct and here is why.

All of this energy already exists. What we consider overload while not entirely correct is pretty good at getting the idea across.

I theorize that the energy exists the vibratory frequencies exist all the time and that by practicing sadhana techniques especially Kriya we start getting more awareness of this fact by developing our selves and in doing so enter into realms we are not able to function correctly in and the interface with flesh and bone can be amazing and at times very difficult. But his is not an overload condition. This is more like a baby learning to walk and falling allot. But the only way to learn to walk is to develop the skill by doing and yes some of the falls can hurt the rump pretty good.

I also agree that if excessive spiritual practices are the cause of the overload condition that it can be dangerous to correct it with more of the same and that is where in my experience the inner Guru comes out of hiding and guides.

While I do say that all these kinds of phenomena are universal there is no way I would ever submit that any two persons path is alike in any way and each must discover by doing.

You and I may both practice a method. We both may say yes why yes that is exactly what I experienced also. I saw the ring of gold with the white 5 pointed star also.

But this is as far as we can compare the impact of that seeing is going to be different for everyone based on many individual factors. This may even be enough to cause some to start a religion or join an Ashram one can never be certain what will come of it.

This is the problem with Traveling Gurus and Organizations they impart powerful tools to any who will ask and chalk it up to Karma for everything that follows. This is great just fine from the altitude of 30,000 feet but for the person practicing they are on there own, so I guess this is part of what makes me share.

I think you are correct when you write:

 The danger of using spiritual practices as a method of dealing with energetic overload is that it can simply compound the issue if the issue was caused by excessive spiritual practices in the first place. Sometimes there can be a delayed reaction in these cases of days, weeks or even months, where initial experiences of relief can backfire on us later on. So tread carefully if you are taking that approach.

The only way to tread carefully though is to tread carefully[:I] and that means to do less but not to stop.

Here is the hidden truth about spiritual practices once you reach a certain point where you cannot stop, nothing else will satisfy you, you will find yourself here in this world but also inhabiting another at the same time and it is just that way and this is part of what makes it such a serious undertaking to even start with.

This must be experienced no one can adequately explain this but it is serious, it also does not matter because you are going to go through this anyway it just may take several lifetimes and come allot slower so it is not even noticed and that is probably the way everything is designed to work anyway.

Inhabiting this world and another at the same time what does that feel like? It feels like your brain is plugged into peace and power and something that is beyond here but at the same time you are fully aware of being here it is like divided attention but at the same time you can focus on any aspect of being here you want to without effort perform tasks of great complexity or write like I am doing now and you get intuitive knowledge about what you want to know. In essence compassionate detachment is the order of things and one becomes ever more a witness to ones own existence but remains a fully functional integrated part of it just not caught up in it.

Have you ever seen a policeman or a doctor helping someone in a terrible situation it is not that they are detached and feel nothing they are compassionately detached and helping if they get too caught up in the drama then they can not help because they will only be adding to it, so it is like this but it is effortless.

There is however an hunger or an ache if you will that nothing but returning to the ultra rarefied states will satisfy the penalty for this if you will is that you return changed still you but different and this takes some getting used to on a regular basis.

Fortunately one also develops a self governing mechanism the interlocks and prevents too much from happening at once but this takes time and I am certain varies between individuals quite a bit.

In Kriya you can just slow the practice to once per day. You can also omit certain exercised like Kriya Pranayama proper and practice the other methods that aid in magnetizing the spine and separating Ida and Pingala and this is very helpful still there are other techniques that aid in balancing these energies without adding to the situation.

Each individual must discover what works for them on their own what works for me may not be good for others and visa versa but it is good we are all sharing this here so others may see what we know by doing and perhaps this will help them discover there way too..