A final goodbye and thank you note

[BlueRaincoat]

Yes ak33, it seems a yes/no answer to this question is just not possible.

It's like asking "Have I reached the highest point of my life yet?" As long as you're alive, it is impossible to answer that question. And wouldn't it be dreadful if you could?

[CarsonZi]

quote:Originally posted by BlueRaincoat

quote:Originally posted by CarsonZi
the energy field radiating extremely far outside of the body.  It was strong enough that I eventually had to "shield" a bit as it was causing distress for some others around me.

I am rather confused about this idea that an advanced yogi's energy is uncomfortable to people around him. I always thought the energy of advanced spiritual beings is uplifting to other people.

Hi BlueRaincoat,

Perhaps your confusion is because I would not fit your definition of an "advanced yogi?"  I really can't say.

Either way, my experience is that when the energy is extremely strong and radiating far outside of the body, it can have both positive and negative effects on those around me.  One thing that happens (nearly every time an opening like this one occurs) is Amrita (my older daughter) will break out into a kundalini rash.  This time the rash appeared only a few hours later, right between her legs and up her back and was quite uncomfortable for her.  Some tallow lotion and the "shielding" helped immensely and the rash is almost completely gone today.  

My other daughter, Akasha, will also experience some negative symptoms although for her they are much less physical than with Amrita.  She is extremely sensitive on a dimensional level and starts to experience an increased amount of "non-human beings" visiting her, mostly during her sleep but not only then.  This increase in external input causes her not to sleep very well and she (being only 2.5yrs old) can have some challenges with interpreting and releasing/channeling the information that she receives from these beings.

Others experience very positive effects from being around when the energy is this strong.  Certain friends of mine will want to hang out nearly every day after an episode like this and they'll often say things like "I love hanging out with you!  I always leave feeling so charged up and vibrant!"  

There is also usually in influx of people looking to "download" when the energy is this strong.  Usually this is just friends who know (more or less) that this is a service I provide, but I'll even have random people walking by my house find reasons to knock on the door and they will end up downloading for  half an hour before they realize it.  

What I'm calling "downloading" is when someone needs another to be fully present to them and their problem(s).  When I share "full presence" with someone they will usually start talking about what they are struggling with at the time and will talk until the whole issue (or issues) is completely out in the open, and then it seems to lose it's "charge" or magnetism.  People often find that after "downloading," the problem they were experiencing no longer is as difficult and often even melts away with little to no effort.

quote:Originally posted by BlueRaincoat

....for two days afterwards I felt light as a feather and serenely happy without any clear reason. So this is how I picture the energy field of somebody very spiritual and the reason why I am confused about what you said above.

My experience with this dynamic seems to point to a "ratio" that plays out depending on the level of sensitivity of the individual in question.  What I've noticed is that those who are extremely sensitive to subtle energies generally experience less positive effects from being around intense levels of light/energy and that those who are much less sensitive generally experience the more positive effects from the light/energy.  

Love,
Carson

[BlueRaincoat]

quote:Originally posted by Giacomo
You suggest that there should be a tangible 'end point' to your journey.

You misunderstand me Giacomo.
What I said is that there is no end point, but there is a journey. And, importantly, there is the aspiration that tomorrow I will hopefully be a better human being than I am today.

[CarsonZi]

quote:Originally posted by BlueRaincoat

And, importantly, there is the aspiration that tomorrow I will hopefully be a better human being than I am today.

Something that happened for me on the path was that eventually even the above aspiration had to drop.  When there are aspirations (even noble ones) for the future you CAN NOT, literally, can not be fully in the present.  All hopes and dreams have to be dropped in order to be fully present in the moment.

Just something to consider perhaps.

Love,
Carson

[BlueRaincoat]

Yes
And there is a goal, but there is no 'end goal'.

[BlueRaincoat]

@CarsonZi
Thank you Carson. It's interesting different people react differently to your energy.
Perhaps your energy will refine as you progress and will become beneficial to everybody?

[BlueRaincoat]

Giacomo, you've practised yoga for how long - 5 years? And you think you've see it all. Or so it seems from the way you express yourself.

Your opinions are appreciated. It might help however if you made them sound a little less final. After all none of us have arrived at the final destination, right? So the limits that seem set in stone today may, tomorrow, turn out to have been just a trick of the mind.

[ak33]

quote:Originally posted by Giacomo

BlueRainCoat, I mean no disrespect.

You really expect to much from meditating. Miracles won't happen. They won't. Period. No matter what 'they' try to tell you. No matter what you read. Do some research online. Read articles about people who meditated for 20 years. Ramakrishna for example, who was considered an avatar still related to people through his ego. He was still human you know...

His so-called energy didn't change anything in the world as a whole. He influenced people by his speeches and writings. That he did.

People on this forum tend to focus on the extraordinary. That is the only reason I left after I realized what enlightenment was.

People tend to want miracles happening. Is life itself not a miracle?

CarsonZi's enery doesn't matter. It really doesn't. Continue to meditate all your life. It's a great practice and a safe haven.

I really don't mean to disrespect you. Just giving you my view point.

Actually some research will show you that advance meditators indeed have said to haveperformed miracles and have subtle energy fields. Milarepa, Sri Yukteshwar, several examples from The Autobiography of a Yogi, Sri M's guru are one of the hundreds of examples. Of course these are in literature so I cannot confirm the validity first hand, but safe to say this many people are not making stuff up, and enough to counteract your point.

I may be making an assumption here, but you sound a lot like Jed McKenna, who has a very dry outlook and intellectual view on enlightenment. I'll tell you know why a purely intellectual approach bothers me compared to meditation (since you have discounted meditation). Our minds are wrought with mental afflictions, cravings, and desires. We act out habitual thought patterns repeatedly. The whole point of emphasizing inner stillness (in AYP, but this theme is consistent in other paths), is so this stupid mind will calm down a bit, and allow us to assess the situation as a witness, or how it really is. Without this aspect, we just play mind games.

I have made several assumptions about your sprititual path in my post, please forgive me. But consider what I have said regardless.

[Dogboy]

Silence is golden .

[BlueRaincoat]

quote:Originally posted by Dogboy

Silence is golden .

It is indeed! so I will say no more

[ak33]

Me too

[CarsonZi]

quote:Originally posted by BlueRaincoat

@CarsonZi
Thank you Carson. It's interesting different people react differently to your energy.
Perhaps your energy will refine as you progress and will become beneficial to everybody?

Perhaps?  Who knows.  What I can say at this point is that this seems to be a common issue amongst the people I know with palpable radiance.  Several other AYPers (both currently and formerly active) I know have to shield to one degree or another in order to keep the intense (both positive and negative) effects from affecting others.  It borders on trespassing on another's free will and this is something that, in my experience, as we wake up we become acutely aware of.  

This is something Katrine and I had to deal with on the AYP retreats we led.  Katrine did not shield at one of the early AYP retreats and it was a very difficult retreat for many of the participants for that reason and that experience really helped us to better understand the energy/sensitivity dynamic I mentioned in my last post.

This (issue) is not something that (from my understanding) indicates a lack of balance on the part of the radiant person in question but I (obviously) could be wrong here.  I guess time will tell.

Love,
Carson

[BlueRaincoat]

Hi Carson

Does shielding diminish the effects of your practices?

This is an issue I have not foreseen. My husband did not sleep well on then few nights when I had kundalini mishaps. I'm keeping an eye to see if it was coincidence. What you're saying suggests there might be some difficulties ahead.

[Dogboy]

Welcome back, Giacomo!

[parvati9]

Some of us are glad you've returned Giacomo.  Welcome back!

Perhaps you'd care to expand on this comment.  You said yesterday - people tend to focus on the extraordinary.  So you left after you realized what enlightenment was.  It's probably true that enlightenment isn't something we can easily put a label on or define ... even though generally regarded as the end of suffering.

Enlightenment can appear as literally anything, can't it?  We may tend to think an enlightened individual would be respectful, courteous, responsible, tactful,  considerate, self sacrificing, compassionate, wise, etc etc ... and above all humble.  Why do we assume that?  People have flaws - all people, even enlightened ones.  Enlightened people are still ordinary.  Maybe the most ordinary.

What is in our hearts that make us believe we know what enlightenment looks like?  Why are we judging and can we trust our own judgment?  From the discussion comments so far, the implication seems to be that if someone claims to be enlightened (or we have judged them as making that claim), that they cannot possibly be what they seem to be claiming.  Isn't it somewhat foolish to assume that we would know what enlightenment always looks like?  How could we possibly know?  Do you, Giacomo, know what enlightenment always looks like?

If enlightenment is the end of suffering, then all we can be relatively certain of is that the one who either appears to be enlightened or to know what enlightenment is - is no longer suffering.  But that isn't sufficient either, is it?  There's an intangible something that accompanies the state of liberation.  Perhaps a capacity for - and patient willingness to - dismantle suffering whenever and wherever it may present.  And to remain present (or mindful) enough to do so.

It appears that you are doing your best to provide, to the best of your ability, an accurate example of what suffering is and is not, what enlightenment is and is not.  An admirable endeavor no matter what station you are at with regard to the endpoint ... or lack thereof.

love
parvati