Need Advice on Starting AYP Group with Addicts

[brother neil]

Carson, Good luck brother, shine your light and let it grow brighter
With love
Neil

[Sparkle]

quote:Originally posted by CarsonZi

Hi Louis,

There is no guarantee on anything in this situation.  I'm sure there will be some people there with NA/AA experience but these will be people that will have recently slipped for sure.  These people are all in forced rehab.  Forced by the courts.  So if they do have a working knowledge of the 12 steps they (the 12 steps) aren't working for them.  
I may be including a few quick Bikrams asanas before we start, but most likely it will be real short and consist of maybe 3 quick stretches.  Nothing major for sure.  Any specific asanas that you would recommend?
In Love,
CarsonZi

Hi Carson
Sorry I missed your post.
Sounds like you are taking on a difficult task. It probably means, like you say further above, that you will see most people once only for look and a try.
With this in mind it would seem the best approach might be to assume that people are only coming once and tailor the practice around this.

So the challenge, as I see it, is to bring a person who is very busy in the head to a place where they can touch some inner peace or silence, even for a brief few seconds.
If this brief few seconds is captured and acknowledged by the person you can emphasise that this is a brief glimpse and that the practice is about developing this to a much more permanent and deeper degree.

And this is the sort of experience they are really looking for in drugs etc, but they are developing it from within themselves through these practices.

It has been my experience that people with very active minds usually have short quick shallow breaths. One of the quickest ways of slowing the mind of a person like this is to get them to change their breathing to slow and deep. Even a few breaths like this before the meditation can make a huge difference.

The Chi Kung with the associated breathing is good for this.
You mentioned yoga asanas, I can't advise you specifically on these but Yogani has a simple programme in his book Asanas Mudras and Bandhas.
Again, an emphasis I would have here is in the slow deep breathing with the asanas.

Other people might chime in on how to bring an active mind down quickly.
Hope that helps[]

[CarsonZi]

Hi Louis,

I think you basically understand now what I am taking on/up against.  Yes, my idea is to tailor a specific routine for this particular application.  What has been generally accepted now is a few stretches to loosen up the muscles, 3 minutes of spinal breathing, 10 minutes of deep meditation, and a 10 minute rest.  I will include as an introduction a bit of my story, which will hopefully help them to understand that I DO know what they are going through right then and there, and that I can help to show them a way to freedom.  We will talk a little about inner silence and how to achieve it, and then will conclude with questions and a snack/juice.  I likely will only see these people once, at the most twice, but I am also setting up a personal meditation group out of my house, so if anyone really catches on and wants to continue but not in the rehab centre setting, then they will be welcome to attend my personal meditation group.  I really don't know how much success I will have, and I am having to jump through some stupid legal and administrative hoops to even get started, but I will not falter in this mission to spread the AYP word.  Oh, I also have "baited" a fella by the name of David Orme Johnson who is one of the main researchers for the TM movement and he is hopefully going to help me design a proper study and set up a study group (hopefully with government funding) and help me quantify any results when he is back inthe country later this year.  Who knows where that will go, if anywhere, but it was worth a shot I thought.  Thanks for the input.

In Love,
CarsonZi

[CarsonZi]

A quick update:

I have a meeting set up with the head of programs and administration at the AADACommission on October 20th.  It will be this meeting that will fully decide whether or not I will be allowed to open this group at the Rehab centre.  The "commission" is supposed to have ZERO sectarian influence and as of now the commitee see's AYP as a sectarian approach to drug withdrawls.  It will be up to me on the 20th to convince a commitee board that AYP is non-sectarian, and should be considered a companion to the 12 steps program which is the ONLY program at this time that is allowed access to the Rehab Centre.  It is also a problem that I am not on their staff yet, as I am considered a contractor and need special permissions to even enter the building.  This could be hard to get seeing as they know I am a former drug addict myself.  It will take a lot of convincing and a lot of divine influence I think if I am going to get this group off of the ground, but I have not given up hope yet.  I will let you know how it goes once I know.  Thanks again for all the support.

In Love,
CarsonZi

[brother neil]

You can always take the i am out of it and tone down some things and call it stretching, breathing, and letting go.  You can make it a physical fitness exercise aimed at working to a deeper level.  During the group you can discuss and pick a key word, love, peace, joy, etc...  If the board will not approve ask them what they would approve of.   A yogi is flexible  in life sometimes we have three choices, swing upstream, get out of the river, or go with the flow, you are asking to enter their river, you play by their rules.  Over time you may be able to express about sound currents, vibrations, etc.. and it may evolve into being aloud to use the mantra.  If you go in there preaching AYP,AYP,AYP, This may ruffle some feathers of the practicioners and administration.  It may make it seem like just another religion
50% is better then 0%
we are love, we are flexible, we are joy
we are what we seek
i am brother neil

[CarsonZi]

I wish it was that simple Tube buddy....
Unfortunately the board see's ANYTHING other then the 12 steps as sectarian and unproven.  Even if I told them that I just wanted to come inside the building to teach a few stretches I would not be allowed.  As of now, the only "contractors" (paid or unpaid) are people teaching/running the 12 steps programs.  This issue is partially because of the fact that this rehab centre is government run.  But the reason I picked this centre is because it is governement run and could potentially be a government recognized study group in the future should things go as I plan, AND because this is a rehab centre I have checked myself into many times when deciding I wanted off of opiates in the past. (didn't work for me, broke out of the building through a window theone time I wasn't allowed to leave of my own will. not good.)  But my approach is going to be pretty much explaining to the board what AYP has done for me, (there is plenty of evidence to consider since they have records on me at this rehab centre, and I will bring my doctors file as well so they can see that I truely am off the program.) explain that AYP IS non-sectarian, and that there is no reason not to at least give me a two week or month long trial run and see how it goes.  A lot of the result is going to be how well-spoken and conscise I am, how well I present the material I need to, and how well I can manipulate the board members emotions to see that this is a worthwhile cause.  I think that the fact that I am a recovered drug addict, and that I am not looking to be paid but just looking to help in a way I know will help, will go a long way in the eyes of the board.  I do not know if I will succeed yet, but I am praying that God will fill me with divine inspiration at the time of the meeting and that I will be a beacon of shining light for Him.  And I hope that the board will see that.
And about just offering a routine of physical excercise, this will not help drug withdrawls, especially not the kind that I will be seeing in the rehab centre.  And my whole reason for trying to start this is because of the profound effects of pranayama and meditation on drug withdrawls.  I should be REALLy sick right now, as I am 3 days into my last dosage drop, from 2.5 to 1mg daily, my biggest percentage drop yet, and I am doing better than fine.  I literally STILL have no withdrawls.  The only symptom that COULD even be attributed to withdrawl from methadone that i have is difficulty sleeping for more then 6 hours at a time.  This could also be a symptom of my spiritual awakening as I am not tired at all, which I would normally be.  i will be flexible believe me, but to be too flexible will mean that I have lost the true reason why I am attempting this at all.  50% would be nice, but my options here are 100% or 0%.  There is no 50% in this situation.  Thanks for the input!

in Love,
CarsonZi

[brother neil]

Good luck with it brother carson I wish you the best in your endevor on this.  if it does not work out there you can always start a group among people you know.  start at a park or something.  sounds as if life is going good for you.  
my blessing to you
i am brother neil

[CarsonZi]

Thanks Neil.  I have another group starting on October 21st at my house, and I just recently had a job offer at a friend's yoga studio in Sydney BC teaching AYP.  Not totally sure if I feel qualified yet, but one way or the other the words getting out.
In Love,
CarsonZi

[markern]

Great work you are doing CarsonZi!

This might interest you:

A statistical meta-analysis of 198 independent treatment outcomes found that meditation produced a significantly larger reduction in tobacco, alcohol, and illicit drug use than either standard substance abuse treatments (including counseling, pharmacological treatments, relaxation training, and Twelve-Step programs) or prevention programs (such as programs to counteract peer-pressure and promote personal development). This meta-analysis controlled for strength of study design and included both heavy and casual users. Whereas, the effects of conventional programs typically decrease sharply by three months, effects of meditation on total abstinence from tobacco, alcohol, and illicit drug ranged from 50% to 89% over a 18 to 22 month period of study. Alcoholism Treatment Quarterly, 11: 13-87, and International Journal of the Addictions, 26: 293-325, 1991.

There is also some preliminary research showing that Sudharsan Kriya has a dramaticly positive effect for people with depression. As I understand it Sudarshan Kriya is more or less Bastrika with falpping arms and just has the same effect only slightly stronger.THe Art of living foundation teaches it as the main practice in their beginning courses and to former addicts in their drug rehabilitation program so apparently it is OK to start of with this. I read that often people have some problems with headaches etc. the first few days of practice but that this passes quickly. The great benefit for addicts it seems to me is that Sudarshan/Bastrika quickly produces loads of good chemicals that gives a sort of high and semi trancendent feeling. This I think is very important for addicts because their psyche is strenthened a lot by whatever these excercises produce in the brain and body and they get the taste for a different kind of high. If one just starts them of with simple meditation that might at first bring them very much into their own pain before they have enough strength. So I think adding a pranyama like this early on will be very beneficial, especialy for those that wouldn`t get through only meditation. So I would supose Bastrika and Deep Meditation could be a good way to go. I haven`t done spinal breathing but since it is so powerfull maybe it is better to start with it rather than Bastrika or maybe that is a reason to wait a bit with it. Anyway you could perhaps consider putting alterante nostril breathing in there pretty quick as it is very balancing and helps a lot with meditation. The inner smile or lvong kindness can be added after a while to work more directly on self esteem and especialy the six healing sounds could be a great way to combine cleansing of the organs with emotional managment in an easy and mostly painless way.

Just my toughts:)

[CarsonZi]

Thanks for the ideas and encouragement Markern,

I really want to stick with AYP for now as it is written down and is a program that can be followed to the letter.  This leaves less room for unwarrented symptoms to occur.  For myself it was the pranayama SB (AYP style) that really created the most drastic effects on drug withdrawls.  Once I added SBP I could almost instantly start reducing my dosage.  It was previously decided to start with 3minutes of SBP and 10minutes of meditation because I wanted to give people a more rounded idea of the practices since I will only be seeing them once and because the effects noticed were not from meditation as directly as from the SBP.  Just my thoughts.

I am extremely sad to announce though that an hour ago I recieved a phone call from the head Program Director at the "Addictions Commission" and she cancelled my appointment to meet with the board next week indefinitely.  She was extremely rude and actually hung up on me while I was in mid sentence, yet I never got angry or ill-tempered. (my instinctual reaction)  Her reasoning was not apparent but she was mad at me before I even answered her call for whatever reason.  Maybe she felt angry that I had gotten as far as to get an appointment with the board while she was away on vacation, but whatever the reason, my chance with this Centre is gone I think.  I have spent my afternoon writing emails to dozens of different people at different levels within the company about this, trying to show reasons why AYP should at least be given a trial run at a detox centre, and I will now include the section that you posted above in my next emails.  Thank you for that.  But I don't anticipate much of a positive response.  The lady who called me is pretty high up and she was pretty mad at me, so....My next step is to start writing to the government for funding to create a study group here in Calgary based on my experiences and info like what you posted above.  I found some links today when searching for people to email, will see how far I get there.

Love,
Carson

[markern]

I am sorry to here about your group being cancelled. I wish you the best of luck in getting it up and going somehow. I do think you will manage that in other ways.

Interesting to hear that spinal breathing had such an effect. Then you should definitively go with that. I tought Bastrika was within the AYP system somewhere, if so it could possibly be added when it seems right. Or maybe it is better to increas SB since it seems so effective.

I am quite sure there is more relevant research out there that can help back your claims. I also would think there are organisations with some experience with using meditation or similar tools with regards to addiction. Art of Living for one seem to be quite experienced. Their program has been in the news several times with very positive feedback from participants.

[CarsonZi]

I have looked into the AoLF and they don't seem to have any programs aimed at substance abuse victims.  I have sent off a couple of emails now to people within the Foundation and will let you know if I hear anything back.  Thanks for your thoughts.

Love,
Carson

[markern]

Maybe they only have it some places. They have one in Norway and I think one in London.

[markern]

the email of the norwegian project for addicts within AOL is post@breathesmart.no. You can write them in english as all norwegians speak fairly good english.

[CarsonZi]

I have ecstatic news....After yesterday's disappointing phone call with the Program Director at AADAC, I sent a barrage of emails to all kinds of different places hoping to open up some new opportunities to share AYP since this one fizzled out...and this morning I came in to work and found an email in my inbox from the contact I had emailed from the Calgary chapter of The Art of Living Foundation....I'll post it below:

Hi Carson,


I commend you and your work. I would be happy to see how we as a foundation can support you. I and others in the foundation would be willing to set up a program for addicts. I know that pranayamas, meditations and such help. We do a short program called breath water sound for people with addictions and such.

I am also sending your email to Joseph, he would be interested in this also. Perhaps we ought have tea.
Please give me a call when you have a chance.  ***-***-****.

many happy smiles

Doug

Thank you Markern for the awesome suggestion...When God closes a door he opens a PORTAL!

Love,
Carson