quote:
Originally posted by Christi
Hi Kirtanman,
quote:
Example of the type of value Swami Lakshmanjoo offers:
Some of you have heard of Devas and Devis --- Gods and Goddesses.
Some of you have made offerings to Devas and Devis.
What are Devas and Devis, *really*?
Your own organs.
Where does it say in the Bagavad Gita that the Davas and Devis are bodily organs?
Christi
Hi Christi,
Swami Lakshmanjoo gives a detailed overview of the exact sutras from the Bhagavad-Gita, along with Abhinavagupta's exposition in the Gita-Samgraha, and the exposition, in the video link I originally posted.
Here it is again, for convenience:
.
VIDEO: Swami Lakshmanjoo, teaching from the Bhagavad-Gita on Devas as Our Organs.
Some of you may be familiar with the fact that most esoteric teachings have four levels of expression:
Literal
Philosophical
Inferred
Mystical/Experiential
In Hebrew, these levels are Peshat, Remez, Derasha & Sod -- easily remembered by the helpful mnemonic PRDS - Garden or Orchard, in Hebrew -- or, as it's better known in English: PARADISE.
![[:)]](http://www.aypsite.com/plus-forum/Smileys/akyhne/icon_smile.gif "Smile")
The yogic/tantric traditions use this same methodology of linguistic encoding as well (four levels, each one less fixed, literal and definitional than the last -- culminating with the level which actually informs all the others: the living exposition of the master).
In Kashmir Shaivism, these levels are usually outlined as the four levels of speech:
Para
Pasyanti
Madhyama
Vaikhari
The literal sutras of any sacred writing, including the Bhagavad-Gita, are at the level of Vaikhari - gross, literal.
Many people are familiar with certain allegorical layers woven into the Bhagavad-Gita; Arjuna as the egoic self or soul, Krishna as the One Self of Pure Subjective Awareness; the two warring factions as the apparent conflicts within dualistic consciousness, and so on. This is the Madhyama level.
Most are unfamiliar with the deeply symbolic, archetypal Pasyanti level, and/or the Para or Paravak level - the exposition of the living master.
Abhinavagupta and Swami Lakshmanjoo are both teaching from these latter two/subtle-most levels -- and ultimately, providing this symbolic teaching of organs-as-Devas from their own experiential authority.
It fits with the interpretative models of Kashmir Shaivism, and they are very powerful:
Limited humans worship Devas and Devis.
Whom do Devas and Devis worship?
The One; the Supreme ----- THIS THAT we each and all actually are, now -- the One Awareness behind and before all form -- including the obscuring layers of the concepts of limited mind.
Ayam Atma Bramha
Tattvam Asi
(All This Is The Self; That You Are.)
Likewise, that's what all the "terrible forms" and "benevolent forms" of the Devas and Devis in Hinduism and Buddhism come from ..... to teach that what appears one way to limited mind is quite the opposite from the view-experience-being of unlimited awareness.
And so .... the organs/senses ... the Devas (the senses themselves) and the Devis (the power of the senses) .... are not the Gods and Goddesses *above* us .... we can only *dream* that is the case.
They are actually our beloved servants, reverently laying the offering of this every renewing fountain of living form known as this moment now at the feet of the One Whom They Love And Serve --- This: I AM --- This: We Each And All Are Now.
Swami Laksmanjoo chants the pertinent sutras, and offers the specific Sanskrit, along with his own exposition, in English, in the video.
That's why, when oral traditions were the norm, it was said that the guru's interpretation was necessary; it was --- most of the applicable levels and layers of meaning in a given sacred writing were encoded in multiple layers.
This is true of the Bhagavad-Gita, the Shiva Sutras of Vasugupta, the Spandakarika, the Vijnanabhairava, the Torah, the Bible .... and so on, and so forth.
They're all just maps -- which need a skilled map-reader to be useful ... because ultimately ... it's only-ever-always .... about where the map leads:
All The Way Home, Now.
Possibly Helpful Note:
As some may know, the Bhagavad-Gita was/is a Vaishnava (Vishnu-centric schools) scripture, and Swami Lakshmanjoo and Abhinavagupta are-were non-dual Shaivites (Shva-centric schools). Most intepretations of the Bhagavad-Gita are dualistic, because most Vaishnavite schools are dualistic; however, there are non-dualistic (Advaitic) Vaishnava schools. In non-dualistic schools, all scriptures and mythologies are recognized to be templates, and so, Krishna, an avatar of Vishnu, in the Bhagavad-Gita ... is seen to be identical with the Shiva of Kashmir Shaivism, and the Brahman of Advaita Vedanta.
In Abhinavagupta's time, the Bhagavad-Gita was the primary scripture in use throughout India, and so, he felt a specifically non-dual recension and commentary on the Bhagavad-Gita would be useful ... and he produced the Gita-Samgraha (loosely translated: "The Song That Holds Unity Together" or "The Song of the Goodness of Oneness" (Gita is Song; Sam can be "Unity" or "Good/Well" and "Graha" is to Hold/Grip/Hold Fast To).
I'm not super-familiar with the Bhagavad-Gita myself; I've read it a few times (Sanskrit and English, line by line) -- but I don't know it well enough to recognize the Sanskrit that Swami Lakshmanjoo rattles off at the beginning of the video, in terms of which sutra it may be; I have the Gita-Samgraha, and it'll probably be easier to find in the book, than by listening/guessing -- I'll plan to take a look in the near future.
In the meantime: my main response to your question, Christi, is simply that it likely doesn't *say* that Devas are organs anywhere in the Bhagavad-Gita, overtly; that reality was-is discovered-articulated by Abhinavagupta and Swami Lakshmanjoo in the time-honored "Sanskritical Analysis" tradition of figuring out *all* the different meanings which can be elicited by the Sanskrit of a given sutra, and therefore, what the essential meaning is .... which is always and ever far beyond words ... but which can be indicated by words.
All of the books Anaitkes listed, by Swami Lakshmanjoo follow this methodology; Mark Dyczkowski's writings literally follow the Yoga Spandakarika (the "user guide" of the Shiva Sutras
![[8D]](http://www.aypsite.com/plus-forum/Smileys/akyhne/icon_smile_cool.gif "Cool")
) line by line, along with exposition on four different commentaries by four different enlightened guys, all of whom follow the mystical-interpretative methodologies I've outlined in this post.)
It's enough to drive those of us raised in a "one word, one definition" culture, and therefore utterly enslaved to the dream of "name and form".
Or, as Kashmir Shaivism states it a bit more clearly: "Denoted Meaning and Denoted Object" -- as in: Cat -- Denoted Meaning is the
word Cat which describes a feline mammal of the often insistent persuasion; Denoted Object is the actual object, denoted by the word, the
physical feline mammal of the often insistent persuasion, known as Cat.
Sanskrit's capabilities of not being tied to any one denoted meaning, rather than making things murky .... actually help to clarify the reality to which Denoted Meanings *and* Denoted Objects can only indicate or symbolize, thus liberating awareness from limited identification with them.
That is the ultimate purpose of language itself -- including the beautiful sutras of the Bhagavad-Gita.
Knowing ourselves; our pure, original awareness as the Living Reality of Consciousness-Bliss to which all sacred writings point - Satchidananda - is what Swami Lakshmanjoo is doing, in the video lecture he offers, linked near the beginning of this post.
I hope this is helpful.
Whole-Heartedly,
Kirtanman
