Domos
30 Posts
Posted - Jan 27 2017 : 1:10:59 PM Show Profile Email Poster Edit Topic Reply with Quote View user's IP address Get a Link to this Message Delete Topic
Hey guys, I was watching some Papaji video on youtube and in a comment a guy was talking about a book, and levels of consciousness.. I got intrigued and went to check.
This is kinda weird, he gives numbers about, supposedly, each teacher/master realization level. He can do it, intuitively, using a method he calls applied kinesiology or something like that.
Here are the "levels":
http://www.ramaji.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Complete_Map_Promo.jpgI was about to discard all this nonsense, until I started reading the sample of his book.. click on the book to read the sample:
https://www.amazon.com/1000-Consciousness-Awakening-Spiritual-Teachers/dp/1497433401/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1485538897&sr=8-1&keywords=1000+ramajiSome examples: (scale from 30 to 1000, above 600 is nondual enlightment)
Adyashanti 784
Eckhart Tolle 674
Jesus Christ 1000
Jiddu krishnamurti 844
Gandhi 733
Pope Francis 548
Ramana Maharshi 1000
Yogananda 769
This is kind weird, I'm not sure what to think. He seems to know what he is writing about, in the book sample I read, yet this is all very strange.. how can you measure "enlightment".. what do you guys think/feel?
Edited by - Domos on Jan 27 2017 1:14:11 PM
sunyata
USA
1386 Posts
Posted - Jan 27 2017 : 9:22:47 PM Show Profile Email Poster Edit Reply Reply with Quote View user's IP address Get a Link to this Reply Delete Reply
Hi Domos,
Interesting thread and the scales of non-dual Enlightenment.
I haven't read the book and do not know the criteria the author has used to assign the numbers. I'm an AYP practitioner so I feel that no one outside of us can measure/rate our Enlightenment.As Yogani says our experience in daily living is the measure of our progress so we alone can measure our level of progress . Of course we can feel someone's presence and radiance but I'm not sure one can precisely rate it.
Also, I'm surprised to see the high numbers against some of the names.
This is the era of Embodiment and not simply the realization of non dual enlightenment. IMHO some of the teachers seems to be lacking in emotional intelligence. However, they were probably non dual realized.
The experience here is with continued practices the personality starts getting more refined and this in turn leads to the light flowing through seamlessly. Embodiment of Enlightenment=Non dual awareness+ Emotional Intelligence + Maturity. Yogani is a perfect example of this. Perhaps this is the flavor of Enlightenment I prefer- Just my two cents for what it's worth.
P.S. At the same time, Embodiement of Enlightenment is not perfection. To expect a teacher to be perfect is our own projection and ignorance. Rather it's authentic, loving, pure, blissful heart transmission. Communication from the divine to the divine.
Edited by - sunyata on Jan 27 2017 9:50:50 PM
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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts
Posted - Jan 27 2017 : 11:01:07 PM Show Profile Email Poster Visit Bodhi Tree's Homepage Edit Reply Reply with Quote View user's IP address Get a Link to this Reply Delete Reply
David Hawkins created the same kind of scale, ranging up to 1000. He validated the scores with muscle testing (applied kinesiology). It's in Power vs. Force.
I figure I'm at 1050, easily. I'm definitely off the charts--unprecedented and record-breaking. I'm so enlightened that I cry tears made out of diamonds, and my laughter turns into rainbows. I also sh*t pure gold. They'll have to extend the scale to account for my transcendental defecation.
I'm sooooo enlightened. You have no idea. Matter of fact, after writing this post, my rating will go up to 1100. Better get to revising that chart, or else you'll miss more of my heavenly glory!
[All apologies. If the scale helps you, bravo. I just couldn't resist.]
P.S. I like Sunyata's mention of emotional intelligence.
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cosmic
USA
821 Posts
Posted - Jan 27 2017 : 11:21:31 PM Show Profile Email Poster Edit Reply Reply with Quote View user's IP address Get a Link to this Reply Delete Reply
This is certainly interesting, but I wouldn't buy into it too much.
I mean, 1000 is "The Absolute"? So what is 1001?
I'd like to know where Neem Karoli Baba is (I believe 1000).
c
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Christi
United Kingdom
3529 Posts
Posted - Jan 28 2017 : 08:18:21 AM Show Profile Email Poster Visit Christi's Homepage Edit Reply Reply with Quote View user's IP address Get a Link to this Reply Delete Reply
Hi Domos and all,
I feel that judging people as to how enlightened they are, or are not, is not a very useful thing to be doing. It doesn't help either the person being judged or the person doing the judging.
Everyone would rate their favourite teachers as being more enlightened and teachers they do not like as much as being less enlightened. So at the end of the day it just becomes an exercise in personal preference. The old likes and dislikes, only in this case being projected onto spiritual teachers.
I would say it is better to simply practice and to discover the truth for ourselves.
As Yogani once said: "Even the saints of this world are not real".
Christi
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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts
Posted - Jan 28 2017 : 10:53:17 AM Show Profile Email Poster Visit Bodhi Tree's Homepage Edit Reply Reply with Quote View user's IP address Get a Link to this Reply Delete Reply
quote:
Originally posted by Christi
I would say it is better to simply practice and to discover the truth for ourselves.
And to let the truth flow through us, so that we are an outpouring of divine love, regardless of benchmarks or speculative levels of attainment (or non-attainment).
In AA, there is a saying: "Less talk, more walk."
All the human beings I admire and view as role models are champions of their craft, and any accolades they have received are only tiny decorations that don't really make up the meat and grit of their existence.
When watching Roger Federer play tennis, I'm not constantly thinking about how he holds the record for most Grand Slams won by a man (17). Rather, I'm enjoying watching the genius of his movement and responsiveness. That's what's most enlightened and inspiring.
Incidentally, Serena Williams just beat her sister Venus last night at the Australian Open to surpass Steffi Graf with the most Grand Slams won by a woman (23).
Anyway, I have some co-workers who are way more enlightened than a bunch of the spiritual celebrities on that 1000-scale list, because my co-workers are impacting people's well-being very directly in the field of healthcare. They're not just talking the talk; they're walking the walk.
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yogani
USA
5147 Posts
Posted - Jan 28 2017 : 11:08:15 AM Show Profile Email Poster Visit yogani's Homepage Edit Reply Reply with Quote View user's IP address Get a Link to this Reply Delete Reply
Yogani is a 99, and sinking fast, into the void.
The guru is in you.
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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts
Posted - Jan 28 2017 : 11:14:46 AM Show Profile Email Poster Visit Bodhi Tree's Homepage Edit Reply Reply with Quote View user's IP address Get a Link to this Reply Delete Reply
quote:
Originally posted by yogani
Yogani is a 99, and sinking fast, into the void.
This makes my day. Actually, my week.
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sunyata
USA
1386 Posts
Posted - Jan 28 2017 : 2:28:34 PM Show Profile Email Poster Edit Reply Reply with Quote View user's IP address Get a Link to this Reply Delete Reply
quote:
Originally posted by Bodhi Tree
I'm so enlightened that I cry tears made out of diamonds
LOL. I want to catch few of those so I'm hoping you'll shed some tears next time.
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sunyata
USA
1386 Posts
Posted - Jan 28 2017 : 2:30:10 PM Show Profile Email Poster Edit Reply Reply with Quote View user's IP address Get a Link to this Reply Delete Reply
quote:
Originally posted by yogani
Yogani is a 99, and sinking fast, into the void.
The guru is in you.
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Dogboy
USA
1547 Posts
Posted - Jan 28 2017 : 4:08:35 PM Show Profile Email Poster Edit Reply Reply with Quote View user's IP address Get a Link to this Reply Delete Reply
quote:
Yogani is a 99, and sinking fast, into the void.
The guru is in you.
You have 99 problems, and that ain't one.
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Blanche
USA
543 Posts
Posted - Jan 28 2017 : 9:40:11 PM Show Profile Email Poster Visit Blanche's Homepage Edit Reply Reply with Quote View user's IP address Get a Link to this Reply Delete Reply
If you want a better look at... ultra-spirituality, check JP Sears on youtube. Hilarious
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Bodhi Tree
2972 Posts
Posted - Jan 29 2017 : 02:32:40 AM Show Profile Email Poster Visit Bodhi Tree's Homepage Edit Reply Reply with Quote View user's IP address Get a Link to this Reply Delete Reply
quote:
Originally posted by sunyata
LOL. I want to catch few of those so I'm hoping you'll shed some tears next time.
No problem. I'm sure you can conjure them out of me.
