energy & dreams

[ab25]

I have had a lot of energy work done and am experiencing a lot of
vivid and lucid dreams. other syptoms make it sound like I am having Kundalini experience. Are dream disturbances a usual part of kundalini?
I have also been doing some crown work, which I guess I should stop.
My yoga teacher teaches ipsalu tantra kriya yoga. She has me meditating to the om mantra and doing hong sau breathing.

AB

[sboney]

Anytime I really gear up my practice or meditate right before bed my dreams become very lucid.  In fact I found this group searching for answers to a dream experience.  In that case it was somewhat troublesome and I reached out to Yogani after searching the internet for someone who could diagnose spiritual/energy symptoms.  Yogani said sounded like a "premature crown opening" and really put my mind at ease about what was otherwise a confusing experience.

[Alexander]

everytime i started a new kind of energy work, my dreams became more vivid and clear.
someone told me, this wasbecause the conenction between your higher bodies and your physical brain got purer and cleaner. as a result dreams seem to be more intense and you remember them better.

namasté

[VIL]

When we realize that we are asleep, we no longer dream - but reach a state of consciousness, Turiya, which transcends AUM: A - Awake.  U - Dreaming. M - Deep Sleep.

 

quote:The Mandukya Upanishad defines turiya as follows,

"The fourth state is not that which is conscious of the subjective, nor that which is conscious of the objective, nor that which is conscious of both, nor that which is simple consciousness, nor that which is all-sentient mass, nor that which is all darkness. It is unseen, transcendent, the sole essence of the consciousness of self, the completion of the world."


Dvaita (Vaishnava) concepts
Four states of consciousness

 

quote:Turiya represents consciousness free from material influence. The idea is that consciousness, of which the atman is constituted, exists in our wakeful state of material experience, as it continues during sleep. In sleep we dream and experience the mental realm, whereas during our waking state the physical plane has more bearing on our lives.

Upon awakening from deep dreamless sleep one remembers existing in that condition. This is evidenced by the common expression, 'I slept well!' One cannot remember something one has no experience of.

Thus in deep sleep when intelligence is transformed by tamo guna, the self continues to exist, as it does when intelligence is transformed by rajo guna during the dream condition and during the wakeful condition when intellect is transformed by sattva guna. The self is thus independent of the body and mind. If the physical and mental realms were to shut down, the self would continue to exist. This we know from our experience in deep sleep. Realizing this involves entering the turiya.

Bhagavan as turiya

Bhagavata Purana 11.15.16 describes Bhagavan with the words turiyakhye (the fourth), the meaning of which is found in the Bhagavad Gita 7.13:

tribhir guna-mayair bhavair ebhih sarvam idam jagat

mohitam nabhijanati mam ebhyah param avyayam

"Deluded by the three [gunas], the whole world does not know Me, who am above them and inexhaustible."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turiya

I'm still asleep:

 

VIL

[ab25]

Well from what little I understand from your responses, it seems like all of the above is true. What do I do about it, ground? I think entering the fourth state of conciousness is fun and all but I need some rest. I noticed it all started back up when I did the OM mantra out loud so I will stop that for now.

As usual I get in water deep enough so I can't wade.

[aditya]

ab25,

I will suggest you to understand the difference between raising the energy and lowering it. Kundalini jagran is raising energy - it is making it 'urdhwareta' or yourself an 'urdhwareta'. When you merge with desire, you are desire itself - you need body to fulfil it - you ready yourself for another cycle of life. Ipsalu tantra is abberation of the path. Will it give you feeling of Kundalini - surely it will - there are many ways to experience K. Will it lead to destination and bring you out of the cycle (and self realization) is entirely different story. Of eight Indian Philosophies, no one ever excelled through - Charvak(or Carvak) philosophy - yavad jivet sukham jivet philosophy ("So long you live, live merrily.").

If physical boundaries are your reasoning - get into Kaula Tantra. If it make you adept and not a bootlegger(excuse me for my language).

Turiya is not possible when you drive in from side of physical desires - or if possible - it will take a Krsna to get it done. (He was Yogeshwar - that is another argument from purists - precisely why ISCON/Bhakti Yoga folks lost Prabhpad in course of time and became parrots.)

I don't think you need to cut your practices if you are wasting it on physical fulfilments, no amount of practice will ever hurt you. Desire is worst drain of all.

Lucid dreaming can be attained by a practice of few weeks to few months - it is not Kundalini jagran. If you can post your other symptoms - it will be easy to decifer your state.

P.S.
1. These are my observations and experience - take is from a person who has crawled on a million miles course for a while. Experts know it better.

2. A nice piece on the abberation:

A mathematician, an engineer and a physicist sat around a table discussing how to measure the volume of a cow. The mathematician suggested the use of geometry and symmetry relationships of the cow, but his idea was rejected on the grounds of being too time consuming. The physicist suggested placing the cow in a pool of water and measuring the change in the height of the water(like Archimedes), but his idea was rejected on the grounds of impracticality. "It's easy," said the engineer. "We'll make an assumption that the cow is a small sphere, calculate the volume and then blow it up to the actual size." I bet he was an electrical engineer.

3. Start with first lesson of ayp, you will find many more lights as and when you are ready for it. All the best.

[yoginstar]

Lucid dreaming can be attained by a practice of few weeks to few months? Wow

I entirely agree with point 3 btw
All the best for the New Year aditya!

[ab25]

I think we are all a little confused, especially me. I am being led by spirit. I practiced shamanism for 3 years, then I was led out of shamanism and into some personal energetic healing( I became my own shaman) for another year or so, then I signed up for energetic healing lead by my higher self. Then when I was lost a guru appeared.This guru teaches Ipsalu tantra, so in a way it chose me or was chosen for me.

I am a confused by aditya's post because I have not stated any of my desires. I have only stated what is happening to me as a result of my
energetic work done in different methods,shamanism and whatever you call what was done to me by spirit. It is my understanding that my previous work has accomplished a lot of the karmic goals of yoga.
As far as cutting my practice, I think 5 min. of meditation a day is
cutting it pretty far.

I am only into yoga for a few hours total in my life, it seems like a good way to learn meditation and energy flow.

[Anthem]

Hi Ab25, welcome to AYP![]

quote:Are dream disturbances a usual part of kundalini?

When kundalini first became active for me I began to experience dream and sleep disturbances. For me a good solution was to meditate further away from bed-time. So finishing up your evening meditation and then going right to sleep might contribute to sleep disturbances as the inner energies are stimulated and haven't had time to balance out.

Self-pacing comes to mind as well. Not sure what your overall routine is like, but if you are adding crown practices to a lot of other energy work you could be over-doing things. Crown practices can be very unstable and can cause a lot of difficulties for you especially if you keep them up for some time without being ready for them. If you have too much energy activity you might need to "self-pace", please see http://www.aypsite.com/plus/MainDirectory.html for more information.

Since you are only doing 5 minutes of meditation it is not very likely that this part of the equation is the culprit, perhaps have a look at whatever other energy work you are doing and consider cutting back, especially with the crown practices.

Best of luck to you,

A

[aditya]

Thanks yoginstar for wishes.

If you like to learn- here is something:

http://cre.ations.net/creation/face-mounted-lucid-dreaming-mask

This one can help too:

http://www.bwgen.com/

Try it before you hit the bed.(I have tried it - you will remain awake like going in the water and coming out). Try swamij's CD - www.swamij.com - I have tried this one too. This CD will not give you heavy head(unlike bwgen). Basically any Yognidra CD will do it.

Third way:

There is a chant in Durga Shaptsati - someone could not just see lucid dreams but actually see things happening in past and near future. She dropped it as it was interfering with her life. I would not like to put it here as it is not per the spirit of forum, but you may find it in any Durga Shaptsati book.

These things are very easy with tantrik methods - you will be amazed to see it.

In lucid dream - you induce sleep with concious controlling it, if you try to enter sleep first and then control it - it is impossible. The time taken master it is the time you need to get lucid dreams. Try Yogani's spinal breathing for a while then get in meditation and then induce sleep. I am not sure if it right thing to do or not though, but it allows to control yourself in what you call sleep. It is not normal sleep - it is controlled one. When people meditate for a while they can wake themselves in predecided time. Lucid dream is one step more.

Months are pretty long time - allow 4-6 hours/day (which is mild effort in meditation as experienced ones will testify) - you will be amazed at the results.

I will give you a parallel - I tried watching aura for years but it was futile. One day I stepped out of my office, went to Borders next block, picked an aura viewing book. Read few pages and left it there - it appeared crap. In the evening I thought of giving it a shot. Tried few times - I failed. But I could feel something is there, very close to human body. Third day I tried again and I could see it. If you practice Reiki, you will be able to see it in 21 days or so(as by product - you don't even try to do it). So, see it is not objective alone, but the method which makes difference. Hope you get the point.

Best new year wishes for you and your family too.

[ab25]

All other energy work has been stopped for one month only meditation is going on now. My only  symptoms are tight jaw and sleep disturbance. I alternate from being tired from no rest and extreme energy flow. It calmed down until I started using the out loud OM mantra. I have overdone something, I was told it will take one to three months to rebalance.

I thought meditation would calm me, but that doesn't seem to be the case. I think the silent meditation was less disturbing.

[aditya]

ab25,

Sorry if I confused you. I would like to understand what does it mean when you say - 'being led by ghost' and 'guru appearing'? Is he/she a physical guru or a guru found in different plane? Please elaborate.

I would like to understand your methods, please feel free to provide pointers.

quote:Originally posted by ab25

I am only into yoga for a few hours total in my life, it seems like a good way to learn meditation and energy flow.

Welcome to the world of light - welcome to Yoga.

[ab25]

aditya:
I want the lucid dreaming to STOP!

[ab25]

I was lead to a real person guru by a spirit(ghost?).
Does this seem strange to you?

I don't really understand my methods. I read that yoga stems from shamanism. In shamanism work is done by spirits.

[aditya]

Yes that is strange for me. I would like to read more about it - allow me some more time. Meanwhile start with reading ayp - you will find tons of diamonds. I read it all before I started, now when I experience something, I read it again. If I do not get it - I post my query and I get  answers from people who experienced similar things. It is wise and easy to follow a path when people have traversed it and they can point your shortcomings - you can alleviate it with ease - else post it again - 'upnishad'- which means - come and sit(at feet with folded hands). The more you put your head down to listen - the easier it is to learn.

P.S. Do not carry the impresssion that people are confused here - many maybe finding path like us - many of these folks are masters atleast for newbies.